Long of Penn St arrested for rape

[cawrestlingfan]

Lock this kid up and throw away the key. SHould this kid even have had a 3rd chance at Penn State?
http://www.centredaily.com/2011/08/13/2877458/penn-state-wrestler-charged-with.html

[Vikingblue]

Sure hope my kid never does something this stupid. Looks like he is already guilty by the peanut gallery and ready for the pen.

[Bruins Coach]

Surprised Cael accepted him into Penn's program, but he might be totally different inside the wrestling room and out. It is always a struggle for coaches to balance things out like this. You always want to give kids chances but at some point you have to set the standard. I think Cael will think pretty hard about having him in their amazing program if he doesn't get found guilty.

[wappatoe]

Maybe Cael was trying to reach out to a troubled young man hoping that he could help him get going in the right direction. Unfortunately you cant be with them 24/7.

[ex-coach]

I wonder if Penn State might tell Cael he needs to decide to either wrestle himself or coach his team. Coaching and competing is not the norm at any University.

[Bruins Coach]

It is also not norm to have the best (still in their prime) wrestler in the US as a head coach. I think he can juggle both. Has a National Championship Team and makes the World Team all in the same year is nothing for Penn to complain about. I also think that he would rather see his team succeed then seek his own glory, so if it causes a problem he will step back and focus on his team.

[Brian Skellenger]

Innocent until proven guilty right? I recall several occasions where this accusation took place and was out of anger or a misunderstanding. One instance was a girl had an epileptic seizure and the gentlemen placing a leather belt between her teeth during the seizure was accused of rape as she ran out of the house without understanding what was taking place. Another was a girl who was very angry after having relations for 3 months and being told she was to go her own way as he went home to his fiance'. Just saying, I have to let someone who can listen to both sides of the story decide to lock someone up. However, he can be let go from the wrestling team for missing practice and probably a hundred other reasons if the Head Coach & AD feel it is best for the time being.

[ex-coach]

It is also not norm to have the best (still in their prime) wrestler in the US as a head coach. I think he can juggle both. Has a National Championship Team and makes the World Team all in the same year is nothing for Penn to complain about. I also think that he would rather see his team succeed then seek his own glory, so if it causes a problem he will step back and focus on his team.

True, but it has happend: (Co) Head Coaches John Smith, Kenny Monday and Bruce Baumgartner. Mark Schultz I believe was asked by BYU to stop fighting after his UFC debut. I personally would not call for it, but in this case a coach brought a "known" discipline problem to the campus and I feel that could be the difference and will at a minimum be discuss. Correct me if I am wrong, but Sanderson might have been out of the country when this took place, not really sure when he returned from his most recent competition in relationship to the incident.

[TwoDogs]

How can he be 22 years old and just completed his sophomore year in college?? I mean I can understand credit wise, but if your clock starts ticking right out of high school, how athletically can you be 22 and just finished your soph season??

[tirapell]

How can he be 22 years old and just completed his sophomore year in college?? I mean I can understand credit wise, but if your clock starts ticking right out of high school, how athletically can you be 22 and just finished your soph season??

Your "clock" does not start until you enroll as a full-time student which I believe is 12+ credit hours.

Here's one way without skipping any years between high school and college:
16-hs freshman
17-hs sophomore
18-hs junior
19-hs senior*
20-redshirt
21-redshirt freshman
22-redshirt sophomore

*you can be 19 years old as a senior in high school as long as you DO NOT turn 20 before June (there is a specific date in June but I don't have it off the top of my head)

[ex-coach]

Your "clock" does not start until you enroll as a full-time student which I believe is 12+ credit hours.

Here's one way without skipping any years between high school and college:
16-hs freshman
17-hs sophomore
18-hs junior
19-hs senior*
20-redshirt
21-redshirt freshman
22-redshirt sophomore

*you can be 19 years old as a senior in high school as long as you DO NOT turn 20 before June (there is a specific date in June but I don't have it off the top of my head)

Or how about this one:

High school senior, 18
US Army, 19
US Army, 20
College full-time true freshman, 21
Religious mission, 22
Religious mission, 23
college sophomore, 24
College Junior, 25
College senior, 26

and I left out a redshirt year.


Two Dogs, go to the BYU website and look at the ages of thier athletes, Long would be the norm. Except he is single I believe.

[Vikingblue]

Your "clock" does not start until you enroll as a full-time student which I believe is 12+ credit hours.

Here's one way without skipping any years between high school and college:
16-hs freshman
17-hs sophomore
18-hs junior
19-hs senior*
20-redshirt
21-redshirt freshman
22-redshirt sophomore

*you can be 19 years old as a senior in high school as long as you DO NOT turn 20 before June (there is a specific date in June but I don't have it off the top of my head)

This is the old bakersfield HS way of counting right?

[tirapell]

This is the old bakersfield HS way of counting right?

I'm just pointing out that it's completely legal and there can be a lot of variation between high school aged kids. The young version, yet still fairly normal, would be:
14-hs freshman
15-hs sophomore
16-hs junior
17-hs senior

So an older freshman could be the equivalent in age of a younger junior. It just depends when you start school, and high school more specifically. Everyone has the option of choosing what is best for them.

[wrestlingman7]

Surprised Cael accepted him into Penn's program.

Do you think Penn State would have won the NCAA title had Coach Jackson not released him from Iowa State? IMO, that is why Coach Sanderson accepted him into his program.

[ex-coach]

Do you think Penn State would have won the NCAA title had Coach Jackson not released him from Iowa State? IMO, that is why Coach Sanderson accepted him into his program.


Sure why not, you do not think good coaches can get amazing things done?


I do not know why he accpeted him, but I have witnessed some pretty compationate things being done for a kid by a college head coach, and that has included either bringing a kid into a progam or telling him to hit the high road.

[wrestlingman7]

Sure why not, you do not think good coaches can get amazing things done?


I do not know why he accpeted him, but I have witnessed some pretty compationate things being done for a kid by a college head coach, and that has included either bringing a kid into a progam or telling him to hit the high road.


Sure I think good coaches can get it done. Did Alton place? Would the back up at 133s place? Probably not. So, how many points did PSU win the NCAA title by? Would they have won without Long? No they would not have.

As for "hitting the road". I am certain Bubba Jenkins knows about that one.

[UniHighCoach]

In this case David is right as they had no one backing him up that would have even qualified---unless they pulled the other Alton from red shirt and he likely couldn't make 133's being that he was a 145 pounder his senior year.

But with Sam Sherlock and Frank Martelotti there @ 133 with a redshirt under there belt now you can bet they wont miss that much of a beat.

Sherlock PA State Champ
Martelotti PA State Champ - 4x Placer

[BetterMove]

But with Sam Sherlock and Frank Martelotti there @ 133 with a redshirt under there belt now you can bet they wont miss that much of a beat.

Sherlock PA State Champ
Martelotti PA State Champ - 4x Placer

Ernie,

Reading the national forums (with no personal inside info) it appears both of those young men might not be eligible. ps. not sure who will win the debate between
wrestlingman7 and ex-coach, they are two of the most knowledgeable posters in Cali wrestling:)

[UniHighCoach]

Ernie,

Reading the national forums (with no personal inside info) it appears both of those young men might not be eligible. ps. not sure who will win the debate between
wrestlingman7 and ex-coach, they are two of the most knowledgeable posters in Cali wrestling:)

The national forums are driven by Iowa and Okie State---I would lay my money one of them will be good to go--

If not than two things are for certain

A) Cael has some pretty big issues to deal with on the horizon

and

B) They should have signed Chris Mecate :)

[wrestlingman7]

Have I heard the story of an unseeded wrestler placing in the NCAA Championships? Happens for as long as I can remember. How about some facts: 2011 3 unseeded heavyweight wrestlers placed in the NCAA Championships they are 1) Alcala (Indiana 5th), 2) Myers (Maryland 6th), and 3) Cooper (ASU 8th). How about 2010? At 125s we had two unseeded wrestlers place they were: 1) Quioroga (Pursue 6th), and Triggas (Ohio State 8th). How about 2009? We had two that I can remember and they were: 1) Krom (Maryland 5th), and Molinaro (PSU 8th). So does it happen? I believe an unseeded wrestler has placed sine 2000. I still stand by my opinion. Had Coach Jackson not released Long to Penn State then Coach Sanderson would not had won the NCAA title. Ay best, PSU would probably had placed 3rd. Why? Because Long scored 10 team points plus 4 points for placing third. Again, this is only my opinion ex coach.

[ex-coach]

Have I heard the story of an unseeded wrestler placing in the NCAA Championships? Happens for as long as I can remember. How about some facts: 2011 3 unseeded heavyweight wrestlers placed in the NCAA Championships they are 1) Alcala (Indiana 5th), 2) Myers (Maryland 6th), and 3) Cooper (ASU 8th). How about 2010? At 125s we had two unseeded wrestlers place they were: 1) Quioroga (Pursue 6th), and Triggas (Ohio State 8th). How about 2009? We had two that I can remember and they were: 1) Krom (Maryland 5th), and Molinaro (PSU 8th). So does it happen? I believe an unseeded wrestler has placed sine 2000. I still stand by my opinion. Had Coach Jackson not released Long to Penn State then Coach Sanderson would not had won the NCAA title. Ay best, PSU would probably had placed 3rd. Why? Because Long scored 10 team points plus 4 points for placing third. Again, this is only my opinion ex coach.

OK, basically freshman Sam Sherwood, 18-3 or Bryan Pearsall, 13-6 with a win in a Big-10 dual and a victory over a then #10 Ohio State wrestler Ian Paddock who scored in the NCAA Championhips, would have had to qualify and score 3.5 points, neither would have had to be an AA as Penn State won the tournament by 14 points and Long scored 17 1/2 with 5 wins, two by fall, for a third place finish. Of course it is not possible to go back in time, but Pearsall was the starter to begin the year.

Probable, a stretch; possible, yes; especially by putting in a second half as the starter. So, at a minimum, 2nd by 3.5 points. Iowa would have still been third. 3.5 points is a win in the champiosnhip round and a fall or default in consolation. Again, I watched a 8-9 Freshman Mark Branch come into the championships and win the title to help lead a wounded Oklahoma St. team to the NCAA Title, is it really that far fetched for either a 13-6 or 18-3 kid to score 3.5 points, just my opinion.

[wrestlingman7]

OK, basically freshman Sam Sherwood, 18-3 or Bryan Pearsall, 13-6 with a win in a Big-10 dual and a victory over a then #10 Ohio State wrestler Ian Paddock who scored in the NCAA Championhips, would have had to qualify and score 3.5 points, neither would have had to be an AA as Penn State won the tournament by 14 points and Long scored 17 1/2 with 5 wins, two by fall, for a third place finish. Of course it is not possible to go back in time, but Pearsall was the starter to begin the year.

Probable, a stretch; possible, yes; especially by putting in a second half as the starter. So, at a minimum, 2nd by 3.5 points. Iowa would have still been third. 3.5 points is a win in the champiosnhip round and a fall or default in consolation. Again, I watched a 8-9 Freshman Mark Branch come into the championships and win the title to help lead a wounded Oklahoma St. team to the NCAA Title, is it really that far fetched for either a 13-6 or 18-3 kid to score 3.5 points, just my opinion.

PSU did not have anyone in their 133 line up that could have out scored Oliver, Hochstrasser, Sentes, Graff, Grey, Ruggirello, or Futtrell. That is all I am saying. Nobody.

[ex-coach]

PSU did not have anyone in their 133 line up that could have out scored Oliver, Hochstrasser, Sentes, Graff, Grey, Ruggirello, or Futtrell. That is all I am saying. Nobody.

That is fine, but they did not need to have an AA at the weight class. PSU had to qualify a body and have him score 3.5 points and they are NCAA Champions if everything else remained the same; not easy, but it was possible, that is all I am saying.

[BetterMove]

two of the smartest posters on the forum:) so smart in fact, even AdamT is not weighingin:)

[UniHighCoach]

Adam unlike me only deals with facts that can be statistically proven. We unfortunately are happily debating a what if scenario :)

[BetterMove]

Adam unlike me only deals with facts that can be statistically proven. We unfortunately are happily debating a what if scenario :)

And i am just using the forum as a coping mechanism, enjoying all of the interactions as I prepare for my son to leave to VA on Monday:)

[All Marine]

Do you think Penn State would have won the NCAA title had Coach Jackson not released him from Iowa State? IMO, that is why Coach Sanderson accepted him into his program.

Coach Sanderson likely accepted Andrew Long into the Penn State program because he had signed Long to a letter of intent while at Iowa State, coached him during his red-shirt season there and liked him as a person; it's not as if the 2 never had a relationship.

While Coach Jackson at ISU did release Long from his scholarship, Coach Sanderson did the same with Bubba Jenkins (for different reasons). Bubba J beat Penn State’s David Taylor in the NCAA finals at 157. If Jenkins had not received his release, he would have been at 165 for Penn State ( a weight Penn State did not qualify for the NCAAs) – or wouldn’t have wrestled at all.

That changes more of the scoring at the NCAA tournament than the “what if” with Long’s points.

[cardinal]

How can he be 22 years old and just completed his sophomore year in college?? I mean I can understand credit wise, but if your clock starts ticking right out of high school, how athletically can you be 22 and just finished your soph season??

I wonder how many past state placers fell into the catagory of 16 yr old freshman and 19 yr old seniors? Some programs and parents use the ploy as an advantage. But college coaches seem to prefer an older and more physically mature freshman.

[djack80]

Take a look at the number of older athletes on the Utah and BYU football teams. Pretty standard in the Mormon world. Is it an advantage? You make the call.